http://www.facebook.com/topic.php?topic=23219&post=210822&uid=78697430614#post210822

DR K- care to wade in???

Oh BTW Bichongal- I live in Europe and our beef is no longer pumped full of tylosin in the name of cutting food costs…

And with respect to the yeast- when was the last time you saw a dog with tear stains scratching its eyes? or beard?? I haven’t- ever.

Vaginal yeast infections or athlete’s foot, for example, are not of the the same magnitude as tear staining.

The next time I have a friend that contracts MRSA I shall ask them to forward the associated bills to you.

Stop being so selfish and irresponsible- there are natural and safe products that work- use them!

Sorry Dr K – i hope you publish this- my ire is raised following the facebook (link) conversation. There are too many blinkered stoopid people out there that really do highlight the flaws in the education system.

Thanks for providing the opportunity, for those of use that have the luxary of being able to wear standard gloves without the need to cram to extra digits into one, finger hole to discuss what really is a part of a much bigger and scary picuture

I am not sure where you have gotten your information but I certainly appreciate your illustration of common misconceptions about antibiotic use. I never disputed the product may work. In fact, if you read my post, I note I believe it could work. My major issue is with labeling and the bad rap we veterinarians get from the medical community about promoting antimicrobial resistance. A well documented medical condition, like chronic colitis, is a reasonable reason to use long-term tylosin.

Some veterinarians DO use tylosin to treat tear staining but most are not sure of the EXACT mechanism by which it works. The major consensus is the medication prevents the production of porphyrins, a pigment, that causes the red stain. We do think the medication alters bacteria counts but it is not treating a yeast infection. Antibiotics, by definition, affect bacterial growth. Antifungals, however, are the appropriate treatment options for yeast infections.

NO MEDICATION IS HARMLESS. None. Not one. Every drug, supplement, and herb has some type of side effect. To say otherwise is negligent and irresponsible.

There is no Tylosin in meat. There are very specific wash-out periods that farmers must adhere to (or risk being shut down) where there can be no trace of any medication in meat and milk.
“Milk [and meat] from animals receiving antibiotics, anthelmintics, anti-inflammatory drugs or other medications must be discarded until freedom from residue can be established, or the animals consuming the treated milk must be withheld from slaughter until a similar withdrawal time has been observed. Food Animal Residue Avoidance Databank is a valuable resource for determining appropriate drug withdrawal times.” – Joan Dean Rowe, DVM, MPVM, PhD Department of Population Health & Reproduction, School of Veterinary Medicine, University of California
Davis

As for the accusations that I am against OTCs because of money, I suppose it doesn’t matter what I say because it appears you have your mind made up about the veterinarian mentality. I can say that thought never crossed my mind and still has no hold on me now that you brought it up. If I was in medicine for the money, I’d have been an MD.

Tylosin is completely harmless. If you eat meat, you are eating Tylosin every time you eat meat and so is your pet.

These vets that go on and on about OTC products, THAT REALLY DO WORK BY THE WAY, are just mad because they are not making any money off the product because they don’t get to prescribe it. But they are so quick to recommend the world’s crappiest, unhealthiest pet food called Hills/Science Diet. That stuff is what is going to kill your pet, not Tylosin.

It’s NOT just cosmetic! Those tear stains are YEAST. Yeast infections are EXTREMELY ITCHY. It is awful to not cure the infection when there are means to do it and try to just pass it off as “cosmetic”. If your pet had a bladder infection wouldn’t you give it antibiotics? If your pet had mange, a skin infection, wouldn’t you give it antibiotics? Then tear stains are no different. The INFECTION requires antibiotics to cure it.

Thanks to this site i have found someone that sells Angels delight locally.

http://bologneseofphoenix.com/shop/index.php?productID=124

Not only does it stop the tear stains but it even helped with Rose’s hot spots.

Why is it taking so long to ban the likes of Angels Eyes and Angels Glow?

I know that some stores have stopped selling them- eg Petsmart but there are still thousands of others out there.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you!!!!

I have to admit that I used to use Angels Eyes. I rang them and ordered some. in about 2 weeks I could see that it was working but was curious as to how.

I was very annoyed that no one had mentioned that the active ingredient was an antibiotic.

From my research online I discovered that tylosin does not have a marketing authority for dog or cat use any where in the world. And as you stated it would be prescription only (under the Extra Label Rule or the Cascading Rule in the UK).

This means that the info on their site is very misleading- they say it is safe for dogs (how do they know that- there is no long term research!!!) – they say it is FDA approved but do not mention that it is not FDA approved for dogs or cats (their target market!!!).

In the UK Angels Eyes et al have been officially banned for a couple of years

http://www.vmd.gov.uk/Publications/MAVIS/Full/mavis66.pdf

In the US the FDA admit that Angels Eyes is illegal but have not yet enforced the law.

I do sympathise with people that used Angels Eyes years ago but now there are natural products that prevent the bacteria from metabolising the iron content WITHOUT the need for antibiotics.

No metabolism means no yeast and ultimately no red stains.

With the likes of

Angels Delight by Bichon Hotel – http://www.bichonhotel.co.uk/angels_delight

and

Naturvet tear stain supplement- http://www.naturvet.com

plus other new products

there is NO EXCUSE for using OTC tylosin based products to deal with tear stains.

Warmest regards and keep up the good work